I'm writing an in-depth document on Seeker culture, for some of the other Seekers who didn't get such a thing. There's going to be a brief overview of Seeker history.
Well, Seeker histories, I should say.
[ There's a brief pause as Starscream does just that, writing it all down in his notes. ]
He was corrupt, then. This implies that the Winglord position was in place... Before the war started? Hmm.
Not corrupt in the sense you are likely thinking, no. Solarburn preferred to... lose himself in the benefits being the Winglord brought him. He was lavish to great fault. He never actively neglected Vos but there was a good portion of his reign that he was keeping Vos in a powerful position for his own perks, no one else's.
[ !! Starscream has to read that last part twice before he's sure he's not misunderstanding. ]
Before the war—! The title dates back to the Age of Origins, before the Quintessons forcibly colonized Cybertron. The Winglord rank is one of the most important surviving principles of Old Vos.
Are you telling me the Winglord title in your world is new??
Yes, and no. The Senate stamped it out millions of years ago, and it was for all intents and purposes a dead role and title until it was revived at the start of the war. An act of defiance.
I don't think a rough date as to when the title was first instated ever survived. At least, I never found one in my own research. We didn't have a Quintesson colonization at any point though, so my guess is it's another fragging thing the Senate robbed us of. A lot of exacts were lost to them.
But we told them where they could fragging shove it, when Comet burned down the Senate's seat of power in Vos. [ He uses perhaps a different set of glyphs, referring to Comet's name. Formality befitting of a Winglord, sure, but also a deep-seated respect. ] He took the position then and there, course.
No Quintessons...? I had not realized your universe's history differed so greatly from my own.
Agreed. The Senate has long resented the power that the Winglord holds in Vos, especially as Vos was highly self-sufficient in its own resources. Sentinel pushed ever more to increase the Council's power in Vos, and to remove or at least limit the Winglord's influence. He tried all manner of methods to achieve that, including the relocation of the Cybertron Air Command to within Vos' borders, no matter how much the High Council's propaganda painted it as "settlement" between Vos and Tarn.
They surely would have preferred someone more compliant in that Air Commander position there, to give them better foothold, which is exactly why I had to sideline my own Winglord ambitions long enough to take Air Command for myself.
I have known of Seekers with the name Comet, but none of them were Winglords past to my knowledge.
They exist and they're lying, crazy fraggers, but Cybertron beat them back enough that they made sure to stay away from all our slag. At least until recently.
Exactly! Their Senator for us was nothing more than a pretty pawn for whatever they wanted; if I remember correctly, they more or less bowed to anything Iacon wanted, and Iacon wanted us and the Air Force muzzled. My Vos had held the position of being the seat of the Air Force for far longer, it sounds like.
...Course, I know a little less about the military part of it. I know there had been some fierce controversy over airspace rights, but when all that slag was going down I was still studying.
[ But at the mention of his silver counterpart not knowing a Comet... There's a pause, as Starscream locates what he's looking for. Hesitates a little, too. Should he send this? But... It would further illustrate the differences, and despite everything Starscream finds this fascinating. It's that scientific itch again, wanting to map it all out.
So he sends a photo of Comet. The previous Winglord is standing among other Seekers, but slightly above them on a piece of debris; it's clearly a shot taken post-battle, judging by the scorches dotting most of them. The glaive in the Winglord's hand is painted with pink energon.
Comet is mostly the dark, military blue-grey, but over top of it he's marked in sharp triangles and stripes of red and gold. For Starscream's world, that had been an old tradition. The markings of a Winglord. Less so were the marks on the part that formed his alt mode's cockpit, and the ones on his pale face. His cockpit is painted in a warbird's snarl, similar to the ones you might find on a human aircraft but instead recognizable as a deep space predator, scratched and worn but still lethal in its presentation.
And Comet is wearing a gladiator's face paint. Red and boomerang-shaped, it extends from his optics and ends in a sharp point. There's another sliver of red colour painted under it- Starscream's counterpart may find it eerily similar to the kind Starscream wore to the Ball. Those had been blue, course... But he had mimicked Comet on purpose. ]
[ Starscream mulls that over for a while, studying the image with a sharp optic. He did pick out the similarities to the painted designs the other had sported at the Ball, and their context makes more sense now. ]
Over airspace authority, yes. Iacon wanted control of it, and specifically the political and legal oversight that went with it, because they wished to impose yet more restrictions to bring Vos more in line with how Fuctionism was enforced there.
That was why the concept of Winglord frightened them. A powerful role that could be won by merit alone. No glad-handing, no popularity contest, no restrictions of caste or construction. It undermined every tenet that Functionism was built on; they hated it.
Fitting that I outlived every one of them, and hurried more than a few along to the Allspark by my own hand.
Airspace authority conflicts. That's such a specific fragging thing to have in common.
...It was a little bit of a 'popularity contest' with ours, I will admit. But only in the sense that Comet wanted it to be that Winglords were held accountable by the people. He wanted it to be that if the whole of our people were unhappy with us, what we were doing-
Well, legal assassination is a light way of putting it. He was fully on board with the idea that if a Winglord had to be ripped to shreds by their own people because they were that much of an ass, they should be. Less 'election that can be bought' and more 'if you frag up enough, they are within their rights to throw you to the cyberwolves'. He did have to fend off one or two challenges, though.
Less than I did. Though most of the true contenders supported my own rise to the position when Comet died at Gier Reach. The Bleeding Sun, mostly. Novastrike probably could've beaten me, too.
Only one or two challenges? That's fortunate. I've had four in the last 3 vorns alone since the war ended.
Assassination was always a possibility, of course, but there are strict rules in place that prevent the title from being claimed that way. Otherwise all you'd end up with is a Winglord with the deepest subspaces who could hire the best assassin. So the Winglord can only be deposed in a flight combat victory.
That was the original purpose of the Winglord, after all: the best flier of Vos bears responsibility for all the others' wellbeing.
For my own ascension, we were in the thick of wartime, our hard-won hold on the Reach tenuous at best, and most of those who wanted to contest me knew that we couldn’t split the Seekers during such a time. Those who did face me were idiots! I showed them their place.
…For Comet…
They loved him too much. We all loved him. One of our best.
[ He almost makes a note about how an aerial battle would have been beyond Comet’s capabilities that early in the war… But decides otherwise. There’d been a reason it had been kept so quiet. ]
You can buy out some people. You cannot buy out as many Seekers as there used to be. As I said, legal assassination is too light a term. We both know we run in groups. More like… Ides of March, if you know the human term. But no elites. No council. Just Comet submitting to the idea that even the least of us could tear him down if he failed.
…And yes, mostly. I will admit I have an interest beyond that; the differences are fascinating. I could write a paper on all this slag, though citations would be a nightmare.
[ Starscream almost makes a cruel observation, that loved is only ever remembered in the past tense, but he doesn't. The glyphs attached to Comet's name are enough to curb his vitriol, this time. ]
I am not your social studies project, Starscream. If you want to learn about Vos as it is in my world for some relevance, that's one thing. But I have better things to do than storytell for you just to relieve your boredom.
[ And Starscream had actually been enjoying this little cultural exchange. It was academic and almost felt like he was getting somewhere, but of course his double won't even accept this olive branch. He was trying, fraggit, and something about this gets him viscerally upset.
It was never about boredom. ]
Then fine, let all your histories end with you, if you're so keen on keeping them to yourself.
At least I'm writing these things down. At least they will survive me. At least the Seekers here will learn what my people used to be.
Don't you dare disparage my interest when all I want to do is make sure we aren't the last.
[ The other Starscream may need to try olive branching in a little less obfuscated manner, given the previous interactions these two have had... as it is, this Winglord has no idea what the goal is here. ]
Don't start with your fragging dramatics yet again, when all I asked is to know what role you intended the information I'm providing to have.
And what makes you think I haven't organized many, many provisions over the eons to ensure this information isn't lost? You assume I wasn't clear-sighted enough to do so, given the way things were in my universe? I've had to share this information because there are so few Seekers left. Don't screech at me just because you've gotten a late start on the same undertaking.
Edited (a rogue comma escaped containment) 2022-04-01 20:23 (UTC)
It wasn't late. I've been doing this since before I was in university! I am just
[ It ends there for a moment, something sent too early as Starscream tries to calm himself back down. It's- Hard. Thundercracker would usually be here to help, to defuse him, to stroke a hand down between his wings and release some of that clawing pressure. ]
I am trying. To engage with you on neutral terms, on a neutral topic, and I happen to like archiving information on Seeker history and culture to consolidate it. Don't
[ Another too long pause. ]
This document needs to be from both of us. It has to cover everything.
I spent too fragging long trying to claw bits of my OWN HERITAGE from others who wouldn't give it to me for this.
[ The long pause this time is on Starscream's end... that message is regarded with no small amount of suspicion. And text is... sure to convey the wrong message, so he switches to voice, his tone carefully level. Skeptical, cautious, but not aggressive. ]
You have never expressed an interest in my input on anything before. You cannot possibly be surprised that open and honest collaboration was not my first assumption of your intent.
[ Their neutrality had only ever been the result of them staying far away from each other whenever possible, not an explicit agreement. ]
...Usually, I wouldn't. [ Starscream's voice is tight, but clearly not with anger. The thread in it is still more upset than anything else, though he tries to keep it from wavering. ]
But this is important. Even if it doesn't all end up in the final document I hand out, it's crucial to have it all in one place.
I don't want them to have just a partial picture. [ This is more than important; this is personal. Even if he hadn't intended for it to be. ]
[ Starscream sends the location ping for a meeting room on the observation deck level, that's usually marked as clearance only and off limits to the general ship. ]
Here will do. It has data facilities, and privacy.
[ Time to make a stop and pick up some engex, then. It's from his own stash, but thankfully nothing too intense, leaving pilfered high-octane from a past member of the Brigade at home.
He knocks on the door when he arrives, bottle and a pair of glasses in hand, assuming his double has already gotten there first. ]
[ Since he had not needed to stop anywhere first, Starscream has indeed arrived first, and used his security clearance to override the room's restrictions. There's nothing sensitive stored in here, simply it's a "non-pedestrian" area, so he's right that they won't have to worry about someone stumbling into their meeting with an interruption. There's also a couple consoles and some screens, which he thought might be useful if they're sharing files, rather than passing datapads back and forth. ]
[ He sets down the engex and the glasses on the table first, all Winglord poise and posture… And then promptly spills no less than three different datapads next to it all from his subspace, just like the academia years that this project has called to mind. Having someone to chat it over with, no matter how hostile, doesn’t help dispel it.
He snatches his own datapad from the table - identifiable by the scrawled etchings of tetrajets on the back courtesy of Skywarp - and leaves the rest. ]
That one, [ He indicates, ] Has everything relevant from my personal 'pad on it, plus everything you’ve told me so far, but it’s not organized yet. I’ve been using that one over there for organization- And it all gets backed up in no less than three different places. Including my own tablet.
[ The thought has percolating for a while, but Starscream is abruptly struck by how much younger his counterpart seems in comparison to himself. When was the last time he'd been that exuberant about sharing something with another? That eager to share a common goal with someone? When had he last felt any delight in his goals, instead of only a grim determination...
Starscream pushes the useless thoughts away, reaches out and picks up the datapad that his other had been using to organize the differences coming up between their worlds. ]
At one time there was an Adjuvant's position in Vos... a Seeker who served directly under the Winglord, and whose role it was to centralize this sort information. A dedicated scribe, if you will. It was also their responsibility to enact a convocation if the Winglord was died outside of a Challenge.
[ Starscream snorts. ] As if I'd trust anyone else to be so thorough.
...Perhaps your position held a council, perhaps it's even meant to, but Comet ruled alone and so have I. [ The tone is nothing but thoughtful, the younger Winglord staring off into space a moment as he turns an idea or two over in his head. The war isn't here. The Brigade would be too small to enact such a thing, but... Something for the future, perhaps. ] I'm not even sure if Comet had a trine. Intensely private mech.
[ He shakes his head. ] Regardless. In my experience a lot of Vosnian Seekers were only concerned with Vos. I have details on Kalisian practices, Tarnish, a little smattering of other variants in the culture... Comet was from Tarn, after all. A fair few important Seekers were from Kalis. We can't afford to leave out anything.
[ mildly irritated: ] Didn't you just squall at me not even an hour ago, thinking that I would take all my knowledge to the Pit if I didn't make provisions to share it?
There is no Winglord council or conclave, there never has been, but there was a time where not every single fragging thing needed to be done personally. Some things could be delegated; there had once been support.
[ He doesn't want to start another argument though... honestly he doesn't. He reaches instead for one of the glasses, picking up the engex that has been supplied. His counterpart has mentioned Kalis multiple times, but this is a first for Tarn, he thinks. ]
While Seekers could have sparked in any of the city-states, the majority of them came from Vos, which is why most Cold Constructed Seekers were also produced in Vos. In my universe, there was never any significant Seeker cultural communities outside of Vos... the Senate's enforcement of flight frames in general was too heavily restricted, so most came to Vos if they were able. But certainly there were shared traits common to those who came from Iacon or Helex or wherever.
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no subject
His reign was indeed considered quite long, a factor he used to his advantage in excess. In all excesses, one might say.
What document?
no subject
Well, Seeker histories, I should say.
[ There's a brief pause as Starscream does just that, writing it all down in his notes. ]
He was corrupt, then. This implies that the Winglord position was in place... Before the war started? Hmm.
no subject
[ !! Starscream has to read that last part twice before he's sure he's not misunderstanding. ]
Before the war—! The title dates back to the Age of Origins, before the Quintessons forcibly colonized Cybertron. The Winglord rank is one of the most important surviving principles of Old Vos.
Are you telling me the Winglord title in your world is new??
no subject
I don't think a rough date as to when the title was first instated ever survived. At least, I never found one in my own research. We didn't have a Quintesson colonization at any point though, so my guess is it's another fragging thing the Senate robbed us of. A lot of exacts were lost to them.
But we told them where they could fragging shove it, when Comet burned down the Senate's seat of power in Vos. [ He uses perhaps a different set of glyphs, referring to Comet's name. Formality befitting of a Winglord, sure, but also a deep-seated respect. ] He took the position then and there, course.
no subject
Agreed. The Senate has long resented the power that the Winglord holds in Vos, especially as Vos was highly self-sufficient in its own resources. Sentinel pushed ever more to increase the Council's power in Vos, and to remove or at least limit the Winglord's influence. He tried all manner of methods to achieve that, including the relocation of the Cybertron Air Command to within Vos' borders, no matter how much the High Council's propaganda painted it as "settlement" between Vos and Tarn.
They surely would have preferred someone more compliant in that Air Commander position there, to give them better foothold, which is exactly why I had to sideline my own Winglord ambitions long enough to take Air Command for myself.
I have known of Seekers with the name Comet, but none of them were Winglords past to my knowledge.
no subject
Exactly! Their Senator for us was nothing more than a pretty pawn for whatever they wanted; if I remember correctly, they more or less bowed to anything Iacon wanted, and Iacon wanted us and the Air Force muzzled. My Vos had held the position of being the seat of the Air Force for far longer, it sounds like.
...Course, I know a little less about the military part of it. I know there had been some fierce controversy over airspace rights, but when all that slag was going down I was still studying.
[ But at the mention of his silver counterpart not knowing a Comet... There's a pause, as Starscream locates what he's looking for. Hesitates a little, too. Should he send this? But... It would further illustrate the differences, and despite everything Starscream finds this fascinating. It's that scientific itch again, wanting to map it all out.
So he sends a photo of Comet. The previous Winglord is standing among other Seekers, but slightly above them on a piece of debris; it's clearly a shot taken post-battle, judging by the scorches dotting most of them. The glaive in the Winglord's hand is painted with pink energon.
Comet is mostly the dark, military blue-grey, but over top of it he's marked in sharp triangles and stripes of red and gold. For Starscream's world, that had been an old tradition. The markings of a Winglord. Less so were the marks on the part that formed his alt mode's cockpit, and the ones on his pale face. His cockpit is painted in a warbird's snarl, similar to the ones you might find on a human aircraft but instead recognizable as a deep space predator, scratched and worn but still lethal in its presentation.
And Comet is wearing a gladiator's face paint. Red and boomerang-shaped, it extends from his optics and ends in a sharp point. There's another sliver of red colour painted under it- Starscream's counterpart may find it eerily similar to the kind Starscream wore to the Ball. Those had been blue, course... But he had mimicked Comet on purpose. ]
no subject
Over airspace authority, yes. Iacon wanted control of it, and specifically the political and legal oversight that went with it, because they wished to impose yet more restrictions to bring Vos more in line with how Fuctionism was enforced there.
That was why the concept of Winglord frightened them. A powerful role that could be won by merit alone. No glad-handing, no popularity contest, no restrictions of caste or construction. It undermined every tenet that Functionism was built on; they hated it.
Fitting that I outlived every one of them, and hurried more than a few along to the Allspark by my own hand.
no subject
...It was a little bit of a 'popularity contest' with ours, I will admit. But only in the sense that Comet wanted it to be that Winglords were held accountable by the people. He wanted it to be that if the whole of our people were unhappy with us, what we were doing-
Well, legal assassination is a light way of putting it. He was fully on board with the idea that if a Winglord had to be ripped to shreds by their own people because they were that much of an ass, they should be. Less 'election that can be bought' and more 'if you frag up enough, they are within their rights to throw you to the cyberwolves'. He did have to fend off one or two challenges, though.
Less than I did. Though most of the true contenders supported my own rise to the position when Comet died at Gier Reach. The Bleeding Sun, mostly. Novastrike probably could've beaten me, too.
no subject
Assassination was always a possibility, of course, but there are strict rules in place that prevent the title from being claimed that way. Otherwise all you'd end up with is a Winglord with the deepest subspaces who could hire the best assassin. So the Winglord can only be deposed in a flight combat victory.
That was the original purpose of the Winglord, after all: the best flier of Vos bears responsibility for all the others' wellbeing.
Is all of this for your file?
no subject
…For Comet…
They loved him too much. We all loved him. One of our best.
[ He almost makes a note about how an aerial battle would have been beyond Comet’s capabilities that early in the war… But decides otherwise. There’d been a reason it had been kept so quiet. ]
You can buy out some people. You cannot buy out as many Seekers as there used to be. As I said, legal assassination is too light a term. We both know we run in groups. More like… Ides of March, if you know the human term. But no elites. No council. Just Comet submitting to the idea that even the least of us could tear him down if he failed.
…And yes, mostly. I will admit I have an interest beyond that; the differences are fascinating. I could write a paper on all this slag, though citations would be a nightmare.
no subject
I am not your social studies project, Starscream. If you want to learn about Vos as it is in my world for some relevance, that's one thing. But I have better things to do than storytell for you just to relieve your boredom.
no subject
It was never about boredom. ]
Then fine, let all your histories end with you, if you're so keen on keeping them to yourself.
At least I'm writing these things down. At least they will survive me. At least the Seekers here will learn what my people used to be.
Don't you dare disparage my interest when all I want to do is make sure we aren't the last.
no subject
Don't start with your fragging dramatics yet again, when all I asked is to know what role you intended the information I'm providing to have.
And what makes you think I haven't organized many, many provisions over the eons to ensure this information isn't lost? You assume I wasn't clear-sighted enough to do so, given the way things were in my universe? I've had to share this information because there are so few Seekers left. Don't screech at me just because you've gotten a late start on the same undertaking.
no subject
[ It ends there for a moment, something sent too early as Starscream tries to calm himself back down. It's- Hard. Thundercracker would usually be here to help, to defuse him, to stroke a hand down between his wings and release some of that clawing pressure. ]
I am trying. To engage with you on neutral terms, on a neutral topic, and I happen to like archiving information on Seeker history and culture to consolidate it. Don't
[ Another too long pause. ]
This document needs to be from both of us. It has to cover everything.
I spent too fragging long trying to claw bits of my OWN HERITAGE from others who wouldn't give it to me for this.
—>voice;
You have never expressed an interest in my input on anything before. You cannot possibly be surprised that open and honest collaboration was not my first assumption of your intent.
[ Their neutrality had only ever been the result of them staying far away from each other whenever possible, not an explicit agreement. ]
no subject
But this is important. Even if it doesn't all end up in the final document I hand out, it's crucial to have it all in one place.
I don't want them to have just a partial picture. [ This is more than important; this is personal. Even if he hadn't intended for it to be. ]
no subject
[ Despite the verbal eyeroll there, it lacks bite. ]
Very well. I'll give you whatever information you need to complete your project.
no subject
[ Rare, from him, and rarer still towards his counterpart. But it feels needed. What a narrow save. ]
We should go over this face to face, at some point. ...Over drinks? Not at Mac's.
no subject
[ Starscream sends the location ping for a meeting room on the observation deck level, that's usually marked as clearance only and off limits to the general ship. ]
Here will do. It has data facilities, and privacy.
[ pause ]
The drinks are probably a good idea.
audio -> action?
[ Time to make a stop and pick up some engex, then. It's from his own stash, but thankfully nothing too intense, leaving pilfered high-octane from a past member of the Brigade at home.
He knocks on the door when he arrives, bottle and a pair of glasses in hand, assuming his double has already gotten there first. ]
no subject
Does this suit?
no subject
[ He sets down the engex and the glasses on the table first, all Winglord poise and posture… And then promptly spills no less than three different datapads next to it all from his subspace, just like the academia years that this project has called to mind. Having someone to chat it over with, no matter how hostile, doesn’t help dispel it.
He snatches his own datapad from the table - identifiable by the scrawled etchings of tetrajets on the back courtesy of Skywarp - and leaves the rest. ]
That one, [ He indicates, ] Has everything relevant from my personal 'pad on it, plus everything you’ve told me so far, but it’s not organized yet. I’ve been using that one over there for organization- And it all gets backed up in no less than three different places. Including my own tablet.
no subject
Starscream pushes the useless thoughts away, reaches out and picks up the datapad that his other had been using to organize the differences coming up between their worlds. ]
At one time there was an Adjuvant's position in Vos... a Seeker who served directly under the Winglord, and whose role it was to centralize this sort information. A dedicated scribe, if you will. It was also their responsibility to enact a convocation if the Winglord was died outside of a Challenge.
no subject
...Perhaps your position held a council, perhaps it's even meant to, but Comet ruled alone and so have I. [ The tone is nothing but thoughtful, the younger Winglord staring off into space a moment as he turns an idea or two over in his head. The war isn't here. The Brigade would be too small to enact such a thing, but... Something for the future, perhaps. ] I'm not even sure if Comet had a trine. Intensely private mech.
[ He shakes his head. ] Regardless. In my experience a lot of Vosnian Seekers were only concerned with Vos. I have details on Kalisian practices, Tarnish, a little smattering of other variants in the culture... Comet was from Tarn, after all. A fair few important Seekers were from Kalis. We can't afford to leave out anything.
no subject
There is no Winglord council or conclave, there never has been, but there was a time where not every single fragging thing needed to be done personally. Some things could be delegated; there had once been support.
[ He doesn't want to start another argument though... honestly he doesn't. He reaches instead for one of the glasses, picking up the engex that has been supplied. His counterpart has mentioned Kalis multiple times, but this is a first for Tarn, he thinks. ]
While Seekers could have sparked in any of the city-states, the majority of them came from Vos, which is why most Cold Constructed Seekers were also produced in Vos. In my universe, there was never any significant Seeker cultural communities outside of Vos... the Senate's enforcement of flight frames in general was too heavily restricted, so most came to Vos if they were able. But certainly there were shared traits common to those who came from Iacon or Helex or wherever.
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